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Time magazine this week reported that 19 states still allow teachers to paddle students in schools. What is even more alarming is that adult acceptance of spanking, while lower than it was 50 years ago, was still approved of by 71% in 2004. The article made me realize that a blog post I wrote a couple of years ago is as relevant as ever. So I’m reprinting it this week with some editing to bring it up to date. If you didn’t read it, please read it now. If you did read it when it was originally published, please read it again. There is an important exercise at the end for everyone, even if you aren’t a parent or your children are grown and out of the house.
There was a time in America when some people were treated as property, forced to do whatever other people wanted, abused without any ability to respond, and unable to obtain their freedom. Such behavior was legal and considered appropriate by the people practicing it.
When we look at the people who exhibited that behavior we think with repulsion, “What could they possibly have been thinking?”
I’m not referring to slavery 150 years ago. I’m referring to the abuse heaped upon millions of children daily by well-meaning parents who don’t realize the long-term damage being done by spanking and other forms of punishment.
Corporal punishment doesn’t work
Research has shown that corporal (physical) punishment not only doesn’t stop the behavior it was intended to stop, it produces a host of negative consequences. These studies have linked corporal punishment to adverse physical, psychological and educational outcomes.
Researcher Elizabeth Gershoff, Ph.D., in a 2002 meta-analytic study that combined 60 years of research on corporal punishment, found that the only positive outcome of corporal punishment was immediate compliance; however, corporal punishment was associated with less long-term compliance. Corporal punishment was linked with nine other negative outcomes, including increased rates of aggression, delinquency, mental health problems, problems in relationships with their parents, and likelihood of being physically abused.
Time several years ago described a new study published in Pediatrics that confirms the results of many earlier studies, “As five-year-olds, the children who had been spanked were more likely than the non-spanked to be defiant, demand immediate satisfaction of their wants and needs, become frustrated easily, have temper tantrums and lash out physically against other people or animals.” (Emphasis added.)
We’ve discovered from our one-on-one sessions with over 13,000 clients that most self-esteem beliefs are formed from interactions with parents during the first six years of life. Spanking produces the dysfunctional behavior described in the studies quoted above because it leads to such beliefs as: I’m powerless. I’m bad. If I do something wrong, I deserve to be punished. There’s something wrong with me. The way to be safe is to have power over others. Violence is an acceptable way to handle disagreements. The way to keep from being punished is to not get caught. I’m not good enough.
Here’s what’s interesting: Most parents would be upset if they realized that their children were forming most of these negative beliefs, but they actually want their children to conclude one of these beliefs as a result of the punishment, namely I have done something bad. They think that knowing they have done something “bad” will prevent their children from doing it again. But if a child thinks over and over that he has done something bad, what is he likely to conclude after a while: I am bad. Imagine the consequences of growing up and living with the sense of yourself that you are a bad person?
Despite all the evidence showing the negative consequences of spanking, many people still argue that it is a useful and appropriate tool for parents. One such person is Dr. James Dobson, a psychologist who Time called “the nation’s most influential evangelical leader.” He argues "
Now you may be thinking, I don’t spank my child and I don’t know any parents who do; it isn’t really that common anymore. In fact, it is a lot more common than you might imagine. A recent survey in the UK showed that seven out of 10 parents used corporal punishment on their children. And as I mentioned earlier when quoting last week’s Time, 71% of adults in the U.S. accept spanking as acceptable discipline. That same story reported that 23% of U.S. parents still support spanking by teachers. The result of that support: According to the Center for Effective Discipline, in the 2006-2007 school year, 223,190 school children in the U.S. were subjected to physical punishment.
Yelling also can be abusive
But that’s only half the story. A lot of people who would never physically abuse their children abuse them emotionally on a regular basis. Such people can grasp the brutality of hitting a defenseless child, but think nothing of screaming at their child, uttering such common phrases as: “What’s wrong with you?” “Are you stupid?” “How many times do I have to tell you?” “Don’t you understand English?” “If you were a good child you’d obey me.” “Why aren’t you a good child like …?”
Our work with clients also has showed us that such emotional abuse often leads to as many negative beliefs about ourselves as physical abuse, including many of the same beliefs that spanking produces, plus I’m not capable, I’m not competent. Mistakes are bad. I’m not loveable. I’m not worthy. I’m inadequate.
There’s an important distinction to be made here: Physical and emotional abuse, as painful as it might be in the moment, has no long-term consequences. But the abuse inevitably leads children to form negative beliefs about themselves and life, that in turn lead to a wide variety of behavioral and emotional problems for the rest of their lives. (Thousands of our clients have stopped their chronic anxiety, eating disorders, needing the approval of others, lack of confidence, mistreatment of others, etc. by eliminating the childhood beliefs that had caused such debilitating problems.)
Why do we hit or yell at our children? The answer most parents probably would give is “Nothing else seems to get my children to listen.” Would you hit or yell at your friends who frustrated you because they wouldn’t listen to your advice? And if that’s not appropriate, what makes it okay to do it to defenseless children?
Shouldn’t children be disciplined if they don’t obey?
Think of a time when your parents disciplined you. … Did you think: I’ll never do that again, or did you think: I’ll make sure I never get caught doing that again? … Did you learn anything from the punishment other than to make sure you didn’t get caught the next time? … Did it instill a moral sense of right and wrong and the desire to do what’s right—or were you just angry with your parents? …
Research has shown that spanking and browbeating sometimes can work to produce immediately compliance due to the fear of punishment, but there is no learning involved. (Actually the children do “learn” [form the belief] that the way to get what you want is to instill fear in others.)
If physical and emotional abuse really worked to permanently change behavior you’d only have to use them once or perhaps a few times. It’s weird to me that parents justify hitting and yelling as a way to get their children to listen, and then keep doing it over and over because their children don’t listen! That reminds me of the old saying: Insanity consists of doing the same thing over and over expecting to get a different result.
By the way, if punishment really worked to deter behavior, almost two-thirds of the people released from prison would not result in the re-arrest, reconviction, or return to prison with or without a new sentence during a three-year period following the prisoner’s release. This figure is taken from “2011 Adult Institutions Outcome Evaluation Report” prepared by the California Department of Corrections And Rehabilitation, and is typical of other states.)
Consider this: If a stranger treated our children the way so many parents do they would be arrested for child abuse. Why is the same behavior toward a child a crime when exhibited by a stranger and perfectly okay if done by parents? Here’s the answer.
Do we really “own” our children?
Many parents feel they are legally and morally justified in forcing their children to do whatever they arbitrarily decide they want their children to do, just because they are the parents. If a master’s absolute dominion over his slaves was justified by the argument that the slaves were “owned” by their masters, isn’t that the implicit argument that justifies punishing children? Obviously, parents don’t consciously think that about their children, but think about it for a moment, isn’t that the implicit assumption out of which most parents operate? Don’t they think: “Who are you to tell me how to parent? They are ‘my’ children.”
If we ever are going to raise a generation of children who don’t have the negative beliefs and day-to-day problems so many of us have today, the first thing we are going to have to do is realize that physical and even emotional abuse results in lasting damage. Not the actual abuse itself, which is over in a few minutes. But the meaning children give that abuse results in crippling beliefs that stay with them and cause them suffering for the rest of their lives.
This post is not meant to make parents feel guilty who didn’t realize the consequences of their behavior or who just don’t have any effective parenting skills. It is meant to destroy, once and for all, the idea that parents “own” their children and have the right to spank or scream at them for disobeying.
Please help get this post into the hands of as many parents as possible. Let’s do whatever we can to hasten the day when everyone looks back at these early 21st century parenting practices in America and says: “What could they possibly have been thinking?”
How to use this post to improve your life (and the life of your child)
If you or your spouse spanks or even yells at your child, consider what you just read and see if you really want to continue doing that. Consider making a promise to your child to never do that again. And find more effective ways to interact with your children that lead to positive instead of negative beliefs.
If it is okay for teachers in your state to spank children while they are in school (for a list of states, click here http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0934191.html), send a note to your state representatives urging them to pass legislation banning all forms of corporal punishment in schools.
In any case, discuss the material in this post with your friends and do what you can to urge other parents to stop spanking their children.
Please comment both on this post and on your results from the exercise.
Your comments and questions increase the value we all receive. I read them all and respond to as many as I can.
If you found this post useful, please tell your friends and followers by using the buttons at the top of this post.
If you would like some free information about how to interact with your children so that they form positive instead of negative beliefs, check out Shelly Lefkoe’s parenting program at http://parentingthelefkoeway.com.
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Copyright ©2012 Morty Lefkoe
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Funny, I was a spanked child, but I was also incredibly obedient. My parents constantly got compliments from strangers about how well behaved my brother and I were. My parents could take us into a china shop, leave us there for hours, and find us in exactly the same place when they returned with absolutely nothing touched. (No, they did not actually do this, but if they wanted to, they could have.)
And yes, when I was spanked, I DID think, “I’ll never do that again.” Even if it was guaranteed I would not get caught, I did not disobey again.
I wasn’t beaten. I never got bruises. Just one hard spank, two or three if I was especially bad. And you know what? My parents didn’t need to do it after I became around seven or eight years old because I became that well behaved. And no, it wasn’t because I was terrified of disobeying them, it was because I knew it was the wrong thing to do.
Children are not delicate little fairies. If we treat them like they’ll fall apart like shattered glass, consider what beliefs THAT will teach them. It’ll teach them they’re not competent. It’ll teach them they’re fragile. They’ll never take risks. They can’t handle anything. I’m not saying spank your children if you don’t want to, but at the very least give kids a little credit and don’t treat them like they’re disasters waiting to happen if the parent sneezes too loudly.
Hi Dusty,
I wrote a blog post a few years ago about the beliefs that a child must have to always behave. Take a look and let me know what you think: https://www.mortylefkoe.com/do-you-really-want-your-child-to-always-be-well-behaved/#
Love, Morty
I just read that blog post Morty. It is perfect. That is the only way to bring up children to have a good self-esteem. When children are very young, they need to be treated with ‘kid gloves’.
I only had to read a couple of paragraphs of that post to think, “Well played, sir. Well played.”
You hit the nail on the head with that one. Even as an adult, I can’t express my opinions around my mother without being mocked, because in her head, I’m younger than her, therefore stupid and have nothing worth saying. I never got spanked for disagreeing with them (that depended on the manner of how I disagreed), but I cannot think of a single occasion where I did disagree with them and *not* get told off. Even today my mother angrily shuts me down immediately (usually with mockery, as I mentioned. If I push it, it’s sulking and the silent treatment) if I disagree with her.
Honestly, I still don’t blame the spanking, and I still stand by the opinion that children are tougher than people think. I do have problems with my mother, but it was not due to the spanking. The yelling was much, much worse. That, and the mockery, the derision and the sulking. Sometimes it feels like handling a small child.
My father did none of that. He was usually the one who spanked me, but he didn’t yell (he would raise his voice on occasion, but never yell), and he treats me and my opinions with respect. I don’t have any problems with him at all.
I would rather be spanked than yelled at.
While everything you just said is true and valid regarding the yelling, the abusive comments parents make, and the assumption of ownership over “their” children, I take issue with one idea that I used to have no problem with. The idea that no form of negative physical touch at all is ok, ever… I’m sorry, but if a child is physically abusive towards another child, then several things need to happen. First, they need to be physically separated from the child they are abusing. Secondly, they need to lose ALL toys AND other privileges, permanently — to the child they abused. Tough cookies, FOREVER, when it comes to physically abusing another child! If they show any resistance at all, I think it’s perfectly ok to spank them, lightly at first, and if that doesn’t work, heavily later. This is a step-by-step penal system that gives them the opportunity to realize that, whether the abuse towards another child was justifiable or not, it’s not going to be tolerated, ever. They need to be reminded of the evil thing they did every time they want their toys or privileges back… The trouble with our society is that parents, usually “Christian” parents, are brainwashed with this idea of “earning back” privileges and so forth. No. Not when it comes to children abusing other children. Abuse can’t be taken back, and the consequences -are- lifelong and devastating. Children have to suffer life-long results of abusing other children before they’ll get that through their heads. Otherwise, they’ll grow up doing what one kid did to me in high school – he tried to drown me in the school’s pool, repeatedly, while everyone just stood around and watched without trying immediately to stop him. In their minds, it was, “Oh well, Jesus will forgive him, it doesn’t matter…” Seriously, that’s what they thought. That sort of -callousness- is the result of “earning back toys taken as punishments/etc.” Zero tolerance is the only way to get kids to understand permanent ramifications of their choices.
And the cycle of abuse continues. I want to cry.
I’m with Janet. JustRosy, you’re saying that in order for children not to hurt/abuse other children, they must be hurt/abused. Morty is advocating change, to break the cycle which takes rising above the situation so that one can see the reality of what is going on and then help children SEE that what they are doing is hurtful/abusive. I hope you rise above your circumstances.
Yes! Go Morty! One of my favorite articles yet.
As a parent and an EFT practitioner volunteering in elementary schools,teaching children how to let go of fear,anger,frustration,I can say that whenever I lost my temper,it had NEVER to do with the kids,it was ALWAYS my unprocessed stuff!
MY flawed beliefs how kids should “function”!
Yes,kids do things that are not tolerable and here’s an example how I handled a situation like that:
When my son was around 15 (you know those crazy years),he and his friends tossed a neighbour kid into the bushes while my son took a video.
The kid came to me complaining and I called my son to verify the story.When he did I said:”Ok,I want you to apologise and in order to make the wrong right,you take the kid to the playground tomorrow,spend the afternoon with him,buy him an ice-cream anything to make him happy.
They both had a great time together and incidents like that never happened again!
Sure yelling or spanking is easier but – as Morty says – it doesn’t resolve anything,quite the contrary!
It’s like taking a pain-relief pill:It eliminates the symptom momentarily but it doesn’t deal with the root of the problem + huge side-effects !
Reminds me of Gibran when he says ‘Your children are not your children’. Yes I wholeheartedly agree with your post and am happily passing it around.
I’m a teacher in NZ and a parent as well. We are not allowed to spank here…you can get arrested as a parent even!!!! I found a wonderful approach called Nurtured Heart Approach which I use both as a parent and teacher. It has so transformed my teaching and my life and goes so well with what Morty says. It a nutshell it empowers children and energizes them when they are doing well, giving little or no energy when they a misbehaving. Consequences are a brief , consistent and above all …. unenergized…save your energy for acknowledging all they are doing right!!! I would not have believed such a simple approach would work until I tried it. My husband is also a teacher and uses it too. Check it out…it’s by Howard Glasser. Cheers from Downunder!
As one who endured a great deal of spanking and abuse from not only my natural parents but also foster and step parents I do not view corporal punishment as a negative. I have raised my son first with reasoning and teaching him right from wrong. and yes they do exist.
In his thirteen years he has had 6 points of contact on his rear end with a small board with his name on it that he signed in person with much education as to why he signed it. He was only swatted one time per infraction with explanation before and reassured afterwards that he was loved. He was not being pushed because of who he was but only his actions in the moment.
There was a point in our society when we did not have to fear going outside or stating our convictions but today there is so many concessions being made for the actions of those who would blame their problems on others as well as their parents actions. It is time that we all accept that we are the cause of our realities and grow up and get over it and quite blaming others.
The Word of God teaches “spare the rod, spoil the child”. Does not mean child abuse. However I have witnessed many out of control mothers who are begging their children to comply and get along. What a sad state of affairs. If they were compliant themselves they would understand how to get their children to get along and comply and be responsible folks.
I once threw myself down on the floor of the WalMart we were in to show my son exactly what his throwing a fit over not getting what he wanted in the moment looked like. Guess what? He woke up from his fit and said to me, “Dad everyone is looking at us” so I replied, “How did that feel?” he never did that again and we have talked about it since and he laughs because he realizes how insane it was that he tried to run me in such a way. He now realizes that when he asks me for something and there is no money to make his dreams come true in the moment it is not because I desire to harm him but moreover there just may be no money to satisfy his immediate desires and there may be a way that we together we may figure out a way to make his dreams come true.
In summary,
Spare the rod and spoil your child but please leave mine alone!
Our society would be better off with a few public floggings as days of old for those who would truly abuse the system and blame others for their short comings.
Haha, I must say your “WalMart tantrum” was genius! Agreed with everything else you said, well put.
Punishment is really the bad choice of words. We don ‘t need to punish, we need to teach. Children are so beautiful. They only want to do what is acceptable. Hitting then for any reason is not acceptable, so they learn that instead. That’s how wars are started. This is such a sore point with me, I had to comment more than usual. Thanks Morty.
Democratic parenting is the only way. When you help children to come to their own natural and logical consequences of their actions, they feel good about themselves while they are learning what works and what doesn’t. If parents could only keep their own egos out of their relationships with their children, they could have great relationships with them.
Thank you for this. I have never wanted to spank my children but have a handful of times when I have been at my whits end. I’m on a mission to learn more parenting skills to avoid it and have been finding some great stuff here and on Shelly’s site. Thanks again!
Hi Kimberly,
Check out Shelly’s material at http://parentingthelefkoeway.com and our eBook at http://lefkoeinstitute.com (see link to parenting eBook on the left).
There is always more to learn.
Love,Morty
Morty,
Thoroughly enjoyed the article. I spanked my two older kids occasionally and never with my youngest child because I learned that hitting my kids had more to do with my frame of my mind than anything that my children did or could ever do. I was spanked growing up and never felt like I learned anything from it except to avoid getting hit rather than any personality/character trait as Juhani stated.
Love and Light,
Lauren
Thank you for the intelligent post. Corporeal punishment doesn’t work, and the residual impact of it has left an indelible mark on me.
Jack
Jack,
I’m sorry to learn that you were the victim of corporal punishment and I hope that you have been able to get passed it. I believe it is true that is doen’t work and only has a negative impact on the child. I too was the victim of serious abuse as a child (physical, mental, emotional, sexual) and decided the only way to live a healthy life was to get out of the situation permanently. I chose to cut all ties with my family. It was a tough thing to do but on some level I think it saved me. The abuse stopped with me…..I have two wonderful kids whom I have never hit or abuse in any other way. There have been the occasional yelling incidents and meltdowns which I am not proud of, but my kids tell me that it isn’t a big deal because 90% of the time I treat them with dignity and respect. I hope that’s true!
I guess my situation (i.e. abuse) is a little more on the extreme side, but I do remember being spanked and I recall those incidents as creating alot of fear and anxiety in me. It definately leaves a mark on you.
I am truly sorry to hear that.
Interesting article.
I see all the comments so far follow in the same spirit as the article. Allow me to present the other side. :)
Amazingly the research you mention contradicts what I’ve seen in day to day life. You know those kids you see in shops who tend to throw tantrums and yell? And their moms plead: “come now, dear, be quite, please, be quite, come on quite down now, if you don’t quiet down the police will come and take you away, etc” and the kids just scream bloody murder and run rampant despite all the cajoling and lying? You know the ones I’m talking about? The ones that grow up to walk past you in school and smack you in the back of your head and they don’t care how much grown ups yell at them because no one can touch them anyway? The ones that continually interrupt grown up conversations and take your stuff without asking, while their moms smile dotingly and their fathers ignore them?
Those are the ones that will make me lovingly spank my kids if I should ever be fortunate enough to have any.
BUT there is a RIGHT way and a WRONG way to go about it. Letting loose in anger is obviously the wrong way. The right way (I believe) is to wait ’til both parents are present, speak to the child about what he has done, ask him if he understands what he has done wrong and then give him a choice of options for punishment. 10 Lashes, allowance taken away, grounded, 100 push ups, etc. If the kid chooses the lashes, then the parent should be sure to not use his bare hand, a slipper will do (same rule applies to animals) and afterwards he should take the kid onto his lap and tell him that the child is still loved.
Growing up my mom spanked me A LOT and at the time I hated it. She came to all my concerts, sports events, helped me with homework, brought my lunch to school every day; pretty much worshiped me.
My dad only spanked/whipped me ONCE – when he was drunk. He never attended anything, barely took any interest in my life, sob story, blah blah, etc. Looking back it is odd that the one that actively loved me was the one who took the time to spank me when I was naughty. ;-)
You mentioned that kids will then try to NOT GET CAUGHT. Interesting. I don’t see that as a “punishment problem”, I see that as a character/personality problem. You get kids who break something and hide it (<- someone I know whose parents spank him, he hid it from my husband and I who would never lift our hands to other peoples' kids!) and you get kids who break something and immediately run to their mom to tell her what they have done in spite of what punishment might await (<- me). So I doubt it has to do with the spankings. It's probably more a personality issue. I may be wrong.
Lastly, I agree that this is something that has been misused and abused! I sympathize with the victims of this type of abuse!
"Spare the rod, spoil the child."
[spoil definition
Verb: Diminish or destroy the value or quality of
Synonyms: ruin – mar – corrupt – damage – vitiate – destroy]
Quite should be “quiet” -.- I proofread it 3 times, wth!?!
you don’t see the connection with spanking a child, and “creating” personality issues? Re-read carefully morty’s article about how spanking creates “beliefs” about his/herself – From your comment, it seems that your experience is that because your mom loved you, and she spanked you, then she was showing you love. (Your Dad never showed love, and only spanked you)… Wow. I don’t see how there is ever a “right” way to hit a child. ( Except to not only apologize afterwards, say that you were wrong, and stick with a promise never to do it again! )
What makes Morty’s comments so real for me, is doing his “change one belief for free” exercise from his website. It was life changing to me to NOW understand what influence my parents had over my own beliefs about myself (I did the exercise “Mistakes and failures are bad”).
“Lovingly spank”. I’ve read this phrase in articles justifying using hitting as a consequence and it still makes no sense to me. Is that the same thing as throwing a kid into the water who has no clue what to do and yell out, “Sink or swim?” which also makes no sense. It’s the beliefs that children pick up from using “spanking as discipline” that’s the core of the problem. As far as the character problem? I have a niece and nephew who were spanked and, of course, they lied because they didn’t want to get hit. All spanking is abuse no matter how “loving” you feel, though it sounds weird that you can feel loving and hit your child at the same time.
OMG!
Sorry Lauren, my reaction was for not intended for your post. I liked your post.
Hi Juhani,
Thanks for taking the time to post your point of view.
You present a false dichotomy: either you abuse your child or you let him run free with no restrictions whatsoever. And because you see some unruly children, you assume that the only solution is spanking.
There are actually many alternatives to physical punishment that do not lead to negative beliefs that run children for the rest of their lives. (See Shelly’s material at http://parentingthelefkoeway.com) By the way, research shows that spanked children are actually more unruly, so the kids you point to as children who need spanking are likely to be ones who already were spanked.
Love, Morty
Thanks for the reply.
You say:
“You present a false dichotomy: either you abuse your child or you let him run free with no restrictions whatsoever. ”
Spanking does not equal abuse. We’ll agree to disagree on that point, I guess. :)
You say:
“you assume that the only solution is spanking.”
I didn’t mean to infer that in any way. There are many ways to punish a child, I simply view spanking as one of the acceptable ways (if done right).
You say:
“There are actually many alternatives to physical punishment ”
Agreed. And I will read that link tomorrow, thank you. I was interested to see what you see as acceptable and effective alternative punishment.
Kind Regards
Ok, either you spank your child or let him run free. That is a false dichotomy. There are many other alternatives. See some of the comments to this blog post.
I would question the need to “punish” a child. There are many ways to teach a child appropriate behavior other than punishment, which a great deal of research shows not only usually doesn’t produce the results you want, it usually produces a lot of negative consequences.
And finally, after working with over 13,000 clients helping them get rid of almost every behavioral and emotional problem possible, we were able to find beliefs as the cause in every case (we know that because when the beliefs were eliminated the problem disappeared) — and most of the negative beliefs came from interactions with parents as a child. 13,000 is a pretty big sample.
Love, Morty
First paragraph
Let’s change that to: “Either you punish your child or let him run rampant.”
It is your opinion that it is false. It’s my opinion that it’s true. Nothing we can do about that, lol.
I’ve read some of the comments, very inspiring! :)
Second paragraph
I may be wrong, but from my limited experience the way to teach something to someone or an animal is through rewards and punishment. So I would view punishment together with reward as necessary tools for learning. Come to think of it, it’s almost a universal rule, isn’t it?
Third paragraph
…I don’t know what to say to that, since I haven’t worked with 1000s of people like you have. I only know what I’ve observed and experienced. Some commenters have mentioned that corporal punishment has never and can “never work”. I’d like to point out that that is false… since here we are (myself, hubby, some people I’ve spoken to who hated it at the time, but are now thankful for it since it changed them for the better.)
Perhaps I should mention here that I agree that abuse can cause severe trauma in children and can be carried through to adulthood. It is very unfortunate and I don’t agree with abuse at all. What I will allow however is spanking in a controlled environment as already discussed. It would be interesting to see research on something like that: responsible parents that incorporate spanking into their disciplinary actions VS uncontrolled spankings/abuse (as the sole means of discipline perhaps?) VS non-physical methods.
Thanks for the food for thought.
3 AM, bed time, lol!
Juhani, I’d like to contribute to the discussion. The reward and punishment dynamic is built on the idea of right and wrong, which is subjective, is only in the mind, and is not a fact. These things don’t exist among animals, who don’t try to impose their ideas of right and wrong on their children, implying that they are not good enough. They don’t reward or punish when they teach something to their offspring: their offspring are naturally motivated to learn what they have a species-specific interest in. The parent is sensitive to this and since it has no ego, no concept of right, wrong, or who they are as a “person”, they don’t interfere with the natural process, and let it unfold. Many people are able to “teach” their children and students the same way. They are sensitive to their needs, their already existing intrinsic motivations, respect that, and therefore help them reach their (arguably limitless) potential, instead of limiting them with their own ideas of what should be right or wrong for the child/student. Wanting to control one’s behavior is driven by fear, not love (love would allow the child to be naturally noisy, untidy, etc. and not judge or evaluate it) and is delusional in its helpful intentions. Even more so because spanking creates the negative self-esteem beliefs, “I’m bad”, “I’m not acceptable”, “The way to assert my will is through physical violence”, regardless of whether the child is later told that he’s still loved. The behavior and the words are not congruent, since the parent’s behavior was not loving, it was judging the child’s behavior as wrong, along with his person (when spanking, I judge the person, not the behavior, that -the behavior- I can tell the child courageously and vulnerably how it doesn’t meet my needs, how I feel because of the unmet need, and what I request from him, while doing my best to empathize with the child so our relationship is built on trust, empathy, honesty and dignity and a natural desire to help each other meet their needs.) Marshall Rosenberg, the founder of Nonviolent Communication raised his kids this way, and Morty’s children were raised similarly, avoiding punishment and its underlying man-made, false ideas of right and wrong, altogether. I applaud your openness to alternatives to physical punishment, and maybe now you’ll be willing to open up to the possibility of physical punishment, regardless if it’s done the “right” or “wrong” way, limits our children later in life through the limiting beliefs it creates; is fear driven, so it harms the relationship with our children, and with ourselves too, as we’re being dishonest about our fear-driven and definitely not love-driven behavior.
Reading about, thinking about or even knowing about people hitting and harming children, as a form of training, gives me a lump in my throat.
How can we have peace in the world, if we show our children that violence is a way of solving problems and issues? I thought this behavior was being eliminated. Where have I been?
Tiffany’s advice and story in her comment should be added to this article Morty.
I agree with no spanking or yelling for that matter. I never spanked my kids and they have turned out to be very respectful, social and self confident teenagers. I have no problems with either of them, except stupid little things, like my son drops everything on the floor! I just close the door and don’t make an issue of it. I only discipline when I feel it’s really warranted. You have to pick your battles with don’t sweat the small stuff. Best to go by the natural consequences rule. Let your kids do what they are going to do and allow them to learn through natural consequences. It doesn’t help them to keep badgering them about all the little things or constantly “rescuing them”. They need the freedom to make mistakes and learn by them. Ofcourse, you have to step in if whatever they are doing is immoral, unhealthy, illegal, unsafe to them or others. Barbara Coloroso’s parenting book Kids are worth it! It is a philosophy of discipline and not punishment with the focus on empowering children. There is a balance you have to strike, because if you’re too laid back or wishy-washy that can have a negative effect on your kids also. I’m no parenting expert, but I must have done something right because my kids are AWESOME human beings and turned out better than I could have ever imagined.
Great info. I agree with this 100%. God bless you Morty.
Hi Morty, I remember reading this article before and enjoyed it a second time. I noticed that you talk a bit about emotional abuse citing a few examples like: yelling, using abusive phrases such as ‘what’s wrong with you’ etc.. I would add that children are so easily conditioned by their parents that even glances from people can trigger beliefs formed early in life. This type of conditioning is difficult to change as it hardly seems abusive. Can you say something about that?
Hi Leila,
Yes, a “look” can lead to negative beliefs as does physical and emotional abuse. This is not conditioning, but beliefs and can be easily eliminated. It doesn’t have to seem abusive to lead to negative beliefs and to be eliminated today.
Love, Morty
To Paul B… the workable alternative solution is to treat children the way you would treat an adult. You can talk to a child about what they’ve done and they will understand. As a child who was spanked for every damn thing, I vowed never to do it to my own children. My son is 7 and because I have always spoken to him calmly, logically and rationally about things he does, he breaks down in tears on those rare occasions that I raise my voice. He’s also incredibly kind and listens to so-called authority figures… he respects people… probably because he is given so much respect. Read “Easy to Love, Difficult to Discipline” by Becky Bailey for solutions on how to discipline. It’s not the be-all-end-all, but it does offer good solutions. The parents who you say are “trying a more peaceful method of dialog”, may actually look the other way about certain things, thus inadvertently encouraging poor behaviors. There is nothing wrong with getting down to a child’s level, and firmly telling them that you will not tolerate certain behaviors and explaining the consequences of the behavior… just like you would tell an adult who wrongs you. I think a key reason why kids are so out of control, doing what they please, and not listening is because they see their parents doing the same thing… not being in control of their emotions and acting out when things don’t go their way. Certainly I don’t know everything about parenting, but I have learned interpersonal skills and conflict-resolution skills by simply being the type of parent who doesn’t resort to spanking or humiliation when my child does something that I don’t like. And at those times when I lose it and yell, I go back, apologize, and talk to my kid about how out of control I was. He does the same thing. We’ll see what happens when he gets older, nonetheless, right now, teachers and other parents agree that he is a great kid, so we must be doing something right.
Hi Tiffany. I agree with you in treating children as people and that is what I did with mine who are now in their 30’s. The reason for my reply to Morty was that the first replies to his article were all agreeing but nobody was offering any alternative solutions, which wasn’t of any help. so i thought i’d stir up the pot a bit ;-). I too have been on the receiving end of verbal and physical abuse and was determined to not treat my children the same way and for the most didn’t. However, just as you have experienced, there are times when you are at your wits ends and you lose it as I said. The first 7 years of a child are the grounding ones and the child is like a sponge taking in everything you say and do. After that though is when they pick up things from school and other kids and start to become more difficult to manage, especially when they become teenagers. All the best with your son.
Hi Morty. Although you eloquently state the problems, your article falls short on solutions. I would say that most parents don’t really want to hit or verbally abuse their children but do so out of frustration as they are at their wits end and do not know what else to do. So, under pressure conditioning kicks in and verbal or physical abuse is served. A lot of parents are trying the more peaceful method of dialog, but the state of society at the moment would tell you that it’s not working either as their children are doing what they please and do not listen to parents or other authority figures. the amount of vandalism and hooliganism is completely out of control. It’s all very well to tell parents what they should not do, but what about giving them a workable alternative solution?
FYI Morty’s wife, Shelley has written many good articles- start here for some WONDERFUL parenting advice-
http://www.improveyourparenting.com/
Hi Paul,
Check out Shelly’s material at http://parentingthelefkoeway.com and our eBook at http://lefkoeinstitute.com (see link to parenting eBook on the left).
Also, check the Table of Contents on this blog for several articles with specific suggestions for parents.
Love,Morty
Children are growing human beings. If they are hurt, during their childhood (the learning stage), they would do the same to others. That is bad conditioning.
I remember plenty of whippings… but for the life of me I have yet to remember once why I was whipped.
So much for linking the behavior with the whipping.
If my parents only knew how much self development work I had to go through to undo the damage of all that abuse…
…Physical and emotional “discipline” doesn’t work period.
Honor the child’s free will, so long as they don’t harm themselves or others. Restrict their free will if they are going to harm themselves or others, but then and only then. Of course though, let them feel the effects of all their free will choices.
… Doing that is by far the better teacher.
Thanks Morty, for expressing so well what I’ve always known and practiced. I did NOT know however, how prevalant spanking still is though. I always remember a coworker telling a group of us one day about the disipline problems of her 3 year old grandson. “Johnny’s begun hitting other kids at school- looks like he needs a good licking himself! ” I thought she was joking until the look on her face showed she was not happy with my laughter!…. My children are grown now, but will definitely pass this article on!